Conversation of Archbishop Lefebre and Bishop Marchioni in 1976: Separation of Church and State and the Social Kingship of Christ

At the risk of repeating myself, I come back to the social kingship of Our Lord Jesus Christ, that dogma of the Catholic faith, which no one can put in doubt without being a heretic: yes, exactly: a heretic!

Do They Still Have the Faith?

Make a judgment then on the dying faith of the Apostolic Nuncio in Bern, Bishop Marchioni, with whom I had the following conversation on March 31, 1976, in Bern:

Lefebre: Some dangerous things can easily be seen… In the declaration on religius liberty, there are some things contrary to what the Popes have taught: it is decided that there can no longer be Catholic States!

Nuncio: But of course, that is evident!

Lefebre: Do you thnk that that is going to do the church any good, this suppression of the Catholic States?

Nuncio: Ah, but you understand, if we do that, we will get a greater religious freedom with the Soviets!

Lefebre: But the social Reign of Our Lord Jesus Christ, what are you doing about that?

Nuncio: You know, that is impossible now; perhaps in the distant future? .. Right now, this Reign is in perhaps in individuals’ we hwave to open ourselves up to the masses.

Lefebre: But the encyclical Quas Primas, what do you do with that?

Nuncio: Oh… the Pope would not write that any more, now!

Lefebre: Did you know that in colombia it was the Holy See that asked for the suppression of the Christian constitution of the State?

Nuncio: Yes, and here also.

Lefebre: In the Valais?

Nuncio: Yes, in the Valais.  Anow, you see, I am invited to all the meetings!

Lefebre: Then you approve the letter that Bishop Adam [Bishop of Sion, in the Valais] wrote to the faithful of his diocese to explain to them why they should vote for the law of separataion of Church and State?

Nuncio: You see, the social kingship of Our Lord, it is very difficult now…

You see, he no longer belie3ves in it: it is an “impossible” or “very difficult” dogma, “which would not be written now any more”!  And how many people think like this today!  How many are incapable of understanding that the Redemption of Our Lord Jesus Christ must be brought about with the help of civil society, and that the State therefore must become, within the limits of the temporal order, the instrument of the application of the work of the Redemption.  they answer you, “Oh, those are two different things; you are mixing politics and religion!”

And yet, all has been created for Our Lord Jesus Christ, and therefore for the accomplishment of the work of the Redemption: everything, including civil society, which, I have told you, is itself a creature of the good Lord!  civil society is not a pure creation of the will of men; it results abvove all from the social nature of man, from the fact that god has created men so that they will live in society; it is written into nature by the creator.  Therefore civil society itself, no loess than individuals, must render homage to god, its author and its end, and sever the redeeming design of Jesus Christ.

Source: Archbishop Marcel Lefebre, They Have Uncrowned Him: From Liberalism to Apostasy, the Conciliar Tragedy (Angelus, Kansas, 1988), pp. 99-101.

Fr. Joe Zerrudo: We need 60 million pesos to establish a Traditional Latin Mass personal parish in Manila

I attended a Traditional Latin Mass in Sikatuna, Quezon City today.  In his homily, Fr. Joe Zerrudo appealed to his flock that they must be zealous in raising Php 60 million, if they want to buy the lot in Cubao and build a church there exclusively for the Traditional Latin Mass.  After more than a month, the church-goers were only able to raise about a hundred thousand.  So one year will just be about one million.  And 60 million means 60 years.

Fr. Zerrudo recounted how he got the permission to celebrate the Traditional Latin Mass in Cubao during the Ecclesia Dei era (pre-Summorum Pontificum).  Fr. Zerrudo already got a permission from Cardinal Sin before when Metro Manila belongs to a single Archdiocese.  But when the archdiocese was split into several dioceses, Cubao became a separate diocese under Bishop Honesto F. Ongtioco.  And Fr. Zerrudo had to seek another permission.

“Bishop,” Fr. Zerrudo said, “Cavite already has a personal parish for the Traditional Latin Mass, with the approval of Bishop Tagle.   So why can’t we have one in Cubao?”

Bishop Ontioco signed the permit.

Fr. Zerrudo’s flock come from all over Metro Manila.  My estimate is that they number about a 100 to 150.  They follow him wherever he is assigned.  At present, Fr. Zerrudo celebrates mass at 1:30–3:00 p.m. at the Parish of Our Lord of Divine Mercy in Sikatuna, Quezon City.  They were only permitted to celebrate mass there; the original parishioners hear mass in English Novus Ordo (Ordinary Form).  They have a mass right after the TLM mass.

“I know you have wealthy friends outside the Philippines.  I asked you to give me their addresses so that I can write to them,” Fr. Zerrudo said.

“What we shall construct will be the first personal parish in the Philippines exclusive to the Traditional Latin Mass.  Let us take this opportunity while the Bishop of Cubao is permitting us to do this.  Let us take this opportunity while His Holiness Benedict XVI is still the pope.  Otherwise, if we get turned away again, and we still have no personal parish established, then I shall find a little room for my altar and outside you shall hear mass with your umbrellas.

“The other option is to wait for the SSPX to be part of the Church hierarchy.  And I would gladly celebrate mass in their chapels (They have a chapel in Our Lady of Victory Church in Cubao).  But this re-entry of the SSPX is unlikely this year or in the next.

“Next week will be the Feast of Christ the King.  We will have 40-hour devotion in front of the Blessed Sacrament exposed.  But since we cannot have it here in the church, then we shall have it in another place (St. Paul’s?) as long as their is no wake the dead there.  We shall start at 1 p.m. on a Friday and end at 1 p.m. on a Sunday.  We shall not anymore have a procession: we are so few and we would look pathetic.  We shall join the bigger one by the Novus Ordo on November 11.”

Here are the contact details of Fr. Zerrudo (I can’t find his email):

Parish Priest
Lord of Divine Mercy Parish
Madasalin cor. Maamo St., Sikatuna Vill., Quezon City
Tel: (02) 921-3337, 433-3239


Archbishop Marcel Lefebre: “They have uncrowned Him: From Liberalism to Apostasy, the Conciliar Tragedy”

Today I received two books from the White Lily blog.  One of them is the following book:

Archbishop Marcel Lefebre, They have uncrowned Him: From Liberalism to Apostasy, The Conciliar Tragedy (Angelus, Kansas, 1988). Softbound.  267 pages.

I am not a member of the SSPX, nor one of its followers.  But we must know where they stand on many issues, such as on religious liberty, freedom of conscience, separation of Church and State, etc–issues that sprang in Second Vatican Council.  The Vatican cosideres these issues important, and that is why it will hold talks with SSPX these coming weeks or months.  We hope that these things gets cleared up once and for all with anathemas for those who hold otherwise, as done in the previous Councils prior to Vatican II.

Author’s Introduction

It is impossible to comprehend this profound crisis without taking into consideration the central event of this century: the Second Vatican Council.  My feelings with regard to that are well enough known, I believe, so that I can express from the outset the essence of my thoughts: without rejecting this Council wholesale, I think that it is the greatest disaster of this century and of all the past centuries, since the founding of the Church.  In this, I am doing nothing but judging it by its fruits, making use of the criterion that Our Lord gave us.  Now when Cardinal Ratzinger is asked to show some good fruits of the Council, he does not know what to answer.  and whereas one day I was asking Cardinal Garrone how a “good” council had been able to produce such bad fruits, he prelied to me, “It is not the Council, it is the means of social communication.”

Alas, it is there that we truly touch on the “mystery of iniquity.”  From the day after the Revolution, the devil raised up on the inside of the Church men filled with the spirit of pride and of novelty, posing as inspired reformers who, draming of reconciling the Church with Liberalism, attempted to bring about an adulterous union between the Church and the principles of the Revolution!  How indeed can Our Lord Jesus Christ be reconciled with an accumulation of errors that are opposed so diametrically to His Grace, to His Truth, to His divinity, to His universal kingship?  No, the Popes were not mistaken when, supported by tradition and assisted by the Holy Ghost, they condemned with their supreme authority and with a remarkable continuity the great liberal Catholic betrayal.  “In such a case, how did the liberal sect succeed in imposing its views in an ecumencial council?  How did the union, against nature, between the Church and the Revolution give birth to the monster, whose inchoherences now fill with fright even its most ardent supporteers?  It is to htese questions that I will do my best to respond in these chapters on Liberalism, by showing that once having pnentrated into the Churchk, the poison of Liberalism leads to apostasy as a natural consequence.


Preface to the American Edition



Part I. Liberalism

  1. The Origins of Liberalism
  2. The Natural Order and Liberalism
  3. Our Lord Jesus Christ and Liberalism
  4. Does the Law Oppress Liberty?
  5. Beneficial Constraints
  6. Necessary Inequalities
  7. Jesus Christ: King of the Republics?
  8. Liberalism, or Society without God
  9. Liberty of Conscience and of Forms of Worship
  10. Religioius Liberty Condemned by the Popes
  11. Freedom of the Press
  12. Liberty in Education
  13. Is there a Public Law of the Church
  14. How They Have Uncrowned Jesus Christ

Part II.  Liberal Catholicism

  1. The Great Betrayal
  2. The Liberal Catholic Mentality
  3. The Popes and Liberal Catholicism
  4. From Lamennais to Sangnier
  5. The Mirage of Pluralism
  6. The Direction of History

Part III.  The Liberal Conspiracy of Satan Against the Church and the Papacy

  1. The conspiracy of the Alta Vendita of the Carbonari
  2. The Popes Unmask the Conspiracy of the Sect
  3. The Subversion of the Church Brought about by a Council

Part IV.  A Revolution in tiara and Cope

  1. The Robber Council of Vatican II
  2. The Spirit of the Council
  3. Searching and Dialogue: Death of the Missionary Spirit
  4. Vatican II in the Light of Tradition
  5. The Religious Liberty of Vatican II
  6. A Pacifist Council
  7. Vatican II, Triumph of Catholic Liberalism
  8. Paul VI, Liberal Pope
  9. A Suicidal Liberalism: the Post-conciliar Reforms
  10. The Remedy for Liberalism: “To Restore All in Christ”
  11. To Rebuild the Catholic City




Baronius Roman Missal (1962) sold at the Our Lady of Victories Church (SSPX)

Baronius missal is sold at Our Lady of Victories Church (SSPX).  The price is P 2000, but without a cover. The book is hardbound.

To go to Our Lady of  Victories Church, you can ride the LRT purple line and drop off at Betty Go Belmonte Station and walk along Betty Go Belmonte street.  If you are coming from Santolan, Marikina, walk to the right.  If you are coming from Recto, walk to the left.  After five blocks, you should arrive at the Church at the corner of Betty Go Belmonte St. and Cannon St.

Another way is to go to Cubao.  Ride a jeep that passes along E. Rodriguez avenue and drop off at Betty Go Belmonte St.  Turn left and walk along Betty Go Belmonte.  The church is two blocks away.

The Our Lady of Victories Church is on the upper floor.  The bookstore is on the lower floor.  My friend bought the Baronius missal.  I bought the Pope Paul’s New Mass for P 200; a more glossy print costs P 450.  There are still lots of good books there.  My friends and I went there on the Feast of Pope St. Pius X on the New Calendar.

I shall talk about my experience of the SSPX mass and my conversations with SSPX priests and bishop in another post.

Archbishop Jesus Dosado denies restricting the Traditional Latin Mass in the Archdiocese of Ozamiz, Philippines

“Archbishop of Ozamiz, Msgr. jesus Dosado, declared that no TLM can be celebrated in his archdiocese without his permission,” wrote an Una Voce member Carlos Palad.

Palad told UCA News on April 16 that he based his assertion on a news brief in the March 16-29 issue of the Philippine bishops’ CBCP Monitor. Titled “Archbishop warns vs ‘unauthorized’ Latin Mass,” the report said Ozamiz archdiocese has issued a warning to its Catholics that “any Latin Mass is deemed illegal without the consent of the Ozamiz Archbishop Jesus Dosado.”

. . .

The archbishop clarified his stand in the recent interview. “I do not forbid (TLM) here,” he said. “If people ask me for that, it is my obligation as a bishop to provide them a priest.” He acknowledged only having SSPX priests saying Mass in his archdiocese. Even though Pope Benedict on Jan. 21 lifted the excommunication of SSPX bishops, he said, priests of the society “can say Mass validly, but not licitly.”

Archbishop Jesus Dosado of Ozamiz, vice chairman of the Philippine bishops’ Commission on Liturgy, says the comment posted on rorate-caeli.blogspot could have stemmed from his refusal years ago to allow a priest of the Society of Saint Pius X (SSPX) to say Mass in his archdiocese.

“I said ‘no way’ not because of the Latin Mass, but because there was something irregular in the ordination of this priest,” the Vincentian archbishop explained in a telephone interview from Ozamiz, 770 kilometers southeast of Manila.


Source:  Union of Catholic Asian News (UCAN).  See Rorate Caeli for comments.

Vatican Lifts Excommunications on SSPX Bishops: Full Text

Decree of the Congregation for Bishops


By way of a letter of December 15, 2008 addressed to His Eminence Cardinal Dario Castrillón Hoyos, President of the Pontifical Commission Ecclesia Dei, Mons. Bernard Fellay, also in the name of the other three Bishops consecrated on June 30, 1988, requested anew the removal of the latae sententiae excommunication formally declared with the Decree of the Prefect of this Congregation on July 1, 1988. In the aforementioned letter, Mons. Fellay affirms, among other things: “We are always firmly determined in our will to remain Catholic and to place all our efforts at the service of the Church of Our Lord Jesus Christ, which is the Roman Catholic Church. We accept its teachings with filial disposition. We believe firmly in the Primacy of Peter and in its prerogatives, and for this the current situation makes us suffer so much.

His Holiness Benedict XVI – paternally sensitive to the spiritual unease manifested by the interested party due to the sanction of excommunication and trusting in the effort expressed by them in the aforementioned letter of not sparing any effort to deepen the necessary discussions with the Authority of the Holy See in the still open matters, so as to achieve shortly a full and satisfactory solution of the problem posed in the origin – decided to reconsider the canonical situation of Bishops Bernard Fellay, Bernard Tissier de Mallerais, Richard Williamson, and Alfonso de Galarreta, arisen with their episcopal consecration.

With this act, it is desired to consolidate the reciprocal relations of confidence and to intensify and grant stability to the relationship of the Fraternity of Saint Pius X with this Apostolic See. This gift of peace, at the end of the Christmas celebrations, is also intended to be a sign to promote unity in the charity of the universal Church and to try to vanquish the scandal of division.

It is hoped that this step be followed by the prompt accomplishment of full communion with the Church of the entire Fraternity of Saint Pius X, thus testifying true fidelity and true recognition of the Magisterium and of the authority of the Pope with the proof of visible unity.

Based on the faculties expressly granted to me by the Holy Father Benedict XVI, in virtue of the present Decree, I remit from Bishops Bernard Fellay, Bernard Tissier de Mallerais, Richard Williamson, and Alfonso de Galarreta the censure of latae sententiae excommunication declared by this Congregation on July 1, 1988, while I declare deprived of any juridical effect, from the present date, the Decree emanated at that time.

Rome, from the Congregation for Bishops, January 21, 2009.

Card. Giovanni Battista Re
Prefect of the Congregation for Bishops


This document was copied from Rorate Caeli, which for years has followed the relationship of SSPX and the Vatican.